Anatomy Of A Beef......Part One: LL Cool J Vs. Kool Moe Dee

As I said last week, we throwing down some WYDU Classics every week in the month of October to celebrate WYDU's 3rd birthday. Before we do......

New Blog....
T.R.O.Y. from Philaflava

Before we jump right into it, I have to bring to attention a DOPE new blog out there. My homies from Philaflava have joined forces to bring possibly the dopest obscure, rare and classic hip hop blog since Bust The Facts. Jaz (from WYDU favorite Cold Rock Da Spot), Jason Gloss (the owner and mastermind behind Philaflava), Admiral, Roy Johnson, Blockhead (yeah, THAT Blockhead), Thun (of Oh Word fame) and some others that I haven't figured out who is all involved over there yet. Some of the material they have been dropping is a first time for showing up on the web, and if you can do that these days, then you got something. They've dropped everything from sample sources, to a B1 discography (if you don't know who B1 is, then you should head over there, take my word....if you do know who B1 was, then you know you should head over there, I don't have to tell you), to some Busy Bee material, to some Spoonie G material, with some Knucklehedz singles mixed in as well as some Now Born Click. That's just the first page, so it's a dope site that all of you that feel you don't get enough of an oldschool fix here anymore....In fact I got five tracks for the next WYDU Classic from the blog and forum.

This week, it's all about beef...all the way from rare to the well done.

Kool Moe Dee was a legend back in the day. His first single "Go See The Doctor" produced by future New Jack Swing guru, Teddy Riley, took off. His self titled solo debut made a splash for Jive/RCA. A very solid debut album would lead into his most popular LP of his career, "How Do You Like Me Now", which would produced the hit's with the title track and "Wild Wild West". It was about this time him and LL Cool J would compete in one of the greatest battles on wax that Hip Hop has ever seen.

Instead of highlighting this myself, I believe there is someone who has more of a detailed view and a better vantage point of the whole beef, a reader sent this excellent coverage and opinion of the Kool Moe Dee Vs. LL Cool J Battle back in the day and I've posted it before, it's such a good read, we'll do it again......all credit and props for this goes to Kevin:


In regards to HipHop, as far as I'm concerned there were always two types of HipHop fans:

1. Those that were just following HipHop through buying records and listening to the radio, but were too young to go to and hang out at the HipHop spots, like Latin Quarters, Rooftop, Bentley's, Roxy, Danceteria, Union Square etc....and only went to the concerts

2. Those who following HipHop though buying records and listening to the radio, and were old enough to hang out at the all the HipHop spots as well as go to the concerts.

Now here is these points have on the Kool Moe Dee vs. LL Cool J rivalry because, Moe Dee may not have been popular amongst those young record buying HipHop fans, but definitely had some support from those older HipHop fans that were hanging out in the HipHop spots especially as he was still rocking at those spots, which in turn has an effect on your outlook on how the battle came about as well as it's outcome and the full insight in regards to their rivalry

SO HAVE A CUP OF TEA AND SOME BISCUITS IN HAND, AND SOME A CIGAR IF YOU SMOKE WHILE READING THIS

When Moe Dee and the HIPHOP CATS were pushing and anticipating for a live battle between these 2, LL KEPT DUCKING AND RUNNING FROM Moe Dee.......and there are incidents to prove it

Now lets, review the Moe Dee vs. LL battle more carefully shall we.........Now readers, make sure you've got a cup of tea and biscuits in your hand for the following info. Now here info about incidents that happen OUTSIDE their battle records that were made, which related to their beef:

Just so you know, the beef between LL and Moe Dee had been brewing for a period of time, since the mid-80's. Moe Dee always suspecting that, LL was letting fame get to his head with a cocky attitude as if those that came before didn't matter (that's what Moe Dee and others had beef with Run)

Especially with LL spitting lines like "greatest rapper in the history of rap itself" etc, then with Moe Dee feeling like LL took his style, and at the same time abruptly brushing off rappers that came before him, was definitely adding logs on the fire of their beef

But here was one incident, which was the straw that broke the camels back for Moe Dee in their beef:

One show night in Boston, LL missed his plane and the show's promoter asked if Rakim and Moe Dee could just go up onstage and rhyme for a while and hold the crowd over with some impromptu freestyle. They agreed, and within 15 minutes along with Grandmaster Dee cutting, Rakim, Jalil, Extacy, Mike C and Kool Moe Dee absolutely wrecking the crowd. Once word got to them that LL was in the house and ready to rock the stage they finally shut it down. Just seconds after the MC's shut it down, whilst still on stage and LL took the stage walked over to a speaker and stood over all the MC's that just saved the show, and began to explain to the crowd why he got on last, and why his name is the biggest name on the marquee. He ranted on in an extreme condescending manner about how his sales showed how he's a bigger star than those MC's that were on the stage and how he's the bigger & better MC than the rest of them

Now it’s known about the order of their records between 1987-1989; How You Like Me Now, Jack The Ripper, Let's Go, and once these records were out, cats where just anticipating the moment when these two will nail their battle in the coffin and would just get on stage.......and as these two had a habit of meeting each other on stage that moment was so close you could taste and touch it.

So let’s list some of the incidents of their meetings which sparked the fire of their battle when it was on from 1987-1989:

One night at the Apollo, LL was there, and he performed Jack The Ripper....people thought Moe Dee wasn't there, so LL acted and fronted like he was calling him out, and like if Moe was there then he would bring it to Moe...but while LL was performing, and face emerges from the crowd, a spot light is on that person, it turns out to be Kool Moe Dee, the crowd was like "OH SHIT THERE GONNA GET ON NOW" AND GOES NUTS....as Moe starts making his way to the stage, LL got nervous, and just rapped up his show, and quickly stormed of the stage.......once Moe got on the stage, LL was gone but the chanting MOE Dee's name from the time he made his way to the stage and even when he was still on stage

Another incident at the Apollo, what happened was the Dj played LL's jack the ripper, and LL was expected to come out, Kool Moe Dee came out instead and snatched the record of the decks, the crowd went wild, and the DJ played an instrumental, and Kool Moe Dee just ripped LL a new asshole in a freestyle, and told the crowd LL's day was coming, and people in the crowd were saying the same thing as well as saying I HOPE LL COMES OUT whilst in the frenzy Moe Dee just put them in.... There battle created so much buzz and a live battle was so anticipated that Arsenio Hall, even offered to let these host and put on their live battle on his show, but LL brushed it off by saying that he'd rather settle it in a boxing ring

But here is one of the final incident, which was the nail in the coffin of their beef in 80's.....this incident took place in late 88 or early 89 in Texas. Moe Dee was doing a show in .....LL shows up during his show and starts blowing kisses to the crowd....Moe Dee tries to step to him for a battle, but LL escapes into the crowd...but Moe Dee spots LL in the crowd and puts the spotlight on him challenging LL to a live battle, but LL refuses again....so Moe does a freestyle dissing LL even dropping the verbal "LL's" on him gets the crowd to BOO LL outta the arena. Moe Dee acknowledged to the crowd the battle was done and dropped/slammed the mic down. Now of course all of these incidents were before 1990-1991 where there were further answer records to their 80’s records; To The Break Of Dawn and Death Blow.

(trav's note: the audio he sent me gave me chills up & down my spine)

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Used CD Shopping Trip 8-24

Second Spin; Denver, Denver Colorado $24.13

I love Fridays, especially after a pay day. I work weird hours during the week, coming in the office by 6 a.m. and getting off between noon and 2 p.m., depending on the work load. This past Friday, I left the office around noon, stopped by Pat's Cheesesteaks (best Philly's in Denver) and munched down on a philly cheesesteak sandwich then decided to hit up Second Spin, probably my favorite used CD stop in Denver. Although it was pay day, after paying bills and the such, I had to watch what I spent. I couldn't do one of my infamous $75-$100 trips. So I pulled a $20 out of the ATM went into the shop. The best thing about Second Spin is they always have pretty good specials going on. This time it was buy two used CD's get the third for half price and their usual any CD 3.99 and under is half priced. They had a fair amount more in terms of selection when it came to the $3.99, they must have missed me, since I hadn't been in for awhile.

Nothing horribly rare by any sense of the means, although a couple CD's I was happy to run into. I think most if not all have been seen on the blog circuit (what hasn't?) and I've even posted more than one of these. I dug through the entire section and since I was on a "strict" budget (I still managed to go over my $20 limit) I only picked the $3.99 and under CD's. The result? Twelve disks for $24.13. Here is my bounty.

Rottin Razkals - Rottin' Ta Da Core (Illtown, 1995) $2.00

1. Intro

2. Batter Up

3. Oh Yeah

4. Frustration

5. A-Yo

6. Hey Alright

7. Lik' a Shot

8. One Time for Ya Mind

9. Get up, Stand Up

10. Life of Bastard Featuring Treach

11. Homiez Niggas

12. Come on Y'all

Naughty By Nature's weed carriers dropped their only album in '95 to a semi warm reception. Nothing terribly exciting about this album, but if you liked Naughty, then you should probably check this album out, shit even Treach is the first person you hear when you play the first song. All the production was done by Naughty (read Kay Gee) so you know what to expect.

JCD & The Dawg Pound - A Day In The Life (Profile, 1992) $2.00

1. Radio Intro

2. St. Louis Niggas

3. Get Naked

4. They Like It Like We Do

5. Day in the Life of a JCD

6. Tilo Sings the Hits

7. Big Bitch

8. Kibbles and Bits

9. Bon Appetit

10. Over Pussy

11. Tell Ya' Bout a Bitch

12. Boot Nat

13. Fish House

14. Budda Rhymes

15. Dog Pound

16. Cold Kaos

17. Gotcha

18. Lou 40 Blues

19. Personal Loser

20. Shout Outs

I remember picking this up on tape way back in the day as a result of seeing it in "The Source" or "Rap Pages" or something like that. I completely forgot about until Dread posted it up on Bust The Facts awhile back. It's not a lost gem or anything, but it's not all that bad. It was executive produced by Courtney Branch & Tracy Kendrick, who did some stuff with the "304 Posse" (DJ Quik, AMG, 2nd II None, Hi-C and Slyk Smoove) which is probably why Slyk Smoove appears on a track.

Success N Effect - Drive By Of Uh Revolutionist (Wrap/Ichiban, 1992) $2.00

1. Intro
2. Success N Tha House
3. Cinfrontation In Mosley Park
4. Bucking On Dope Niggers
5. Bullshit Views
6. Raised From Depression
7. Brainwashed Niggers
8. Real Black Souljas
9. Gameplan
10. Ultimatedrive By
11. Police Brutality
12. Fuck1 Time
13. Wblk (We Be Black)
14. Black Radio Aint Black
15. Pimps And Players
16. Out Ta Get Rich
17. Warr
18. Forty Aces And A Mule
19. Fuck The System
20. Comin' Up
21. Voice Of A Black Revolutionist
22. The Other Levell
23. Change The Dial
24. Final Call

For some reason, I've always liked this group, although I'm not really sure why. I guess its because I love their self-titled debut album, which is just about a bitch to find a real copy of. They changed over their three album career. If I remember right, this is their last album they released, which was basically on a black power platform, but some good music, filled with common and familar breaks and samples.

Mic Geronimo - Vendetta (Blunt Recordings, 1997) $1.50

1. Nothin' Move But The Money
2. Vendetta
3. Survival
4. Life N Lessons
5. For Tha Family
6. Street Life
7. Be Like Mic
8. Unstoppable
9. Single Life
10. Things Ain't What They Used To Be
11. How You Been?
12. Usual Suspects

I've never been a big Mic Geronimo fan, I'm not sure why, but he has never excited me. Well, after Polarity dropped a review his one cent album, I've had some weird desire to hear it. Just by looking at the production list on it, you'd think it would have a good chance of making some noise.

Kool Moe Dee - Knowledge Is King (Jive/RCA, 1989) $1.50

1. They Want Money
2. The Avenue
3. I Go To Work
4. All Night Long
5. Knowledge Is King
6. I'm Hittin' Hard
7. Get The Picture
8. I'm Blowin' Up
9. The Don
10. Pump Your Fist

I've always enjoyed this Kool Moe Dee album more than any of his other ones for some reason. I had this on tape, but never did pick up the CD for some reason. "Pump Your Fist" was always one of my favorite Moe Dee joints. This was also about the time he started dabbling a bit in the New Jack Swing stuff that pops up on here in a few places.

DJ Jazzy Jeff & The Fresh Prince - ....And In This Corner (Jive/RCA, 1989) $1.50

1. Then She Bit Me
2. I Think I Can Beat Mike Tyson
   
3. Jazzy's Groove
4. Everything That Glitters (Ain't Always Gold)
5. You Got It (Donut)
6. Girlie Had a Mustache
7. Reverend
8. Who Stole My Car?
9. Men of You Dreams
10. Numero Uno
11. Too Damn Hype
12. Jeff Waz on the Beat Box

I ain't gonna lie, I though Jeff's and Will's first four albums were great, and I always particularly liked this LP. Not sure why, its just fun to listen to.

Easy Mo Bee - Now Or Never: Odyssey 2000 $2.00

1. Now Or Never

2. Sunstroke

3. Fie Fie Delish

4. Instrumental No.1

5. S---'s Goin' Down Tonite

6. Soul

7. Talkin' Bout You

8. Instrumental No.2

9. N.Y.C.

10. *69 Monique No.1

11. Sex, Money, Drugs

12. Instrumental No.3

13. Sound Of My Heat

14. Let's Make Toast

15. *69 Monique No.2

16. Make Em Bounce

17. Dis Beat Is Mine

18. Instrumental No.4

19. *69 Monique No.3

20. Always Be There For You

21. We Pledge Allegiance I was kind of scared of this one, there for I never heard it, which is kind of weird for me. This got a lot of bad reviews and the such. While it could stand some trimming on the track list, it isn't nearly as bad as I was thinking it would be.

Lord Tariq & Peter Gunz - Make It Reign (Columbia, 1998) $1.50

1. Make It Reign

2. We Will Ball

3. Massive Heat

4. Sex, Money, Life Or Death Interlude

5. One Life To Live

6. Fiesta

7. Then & Now Interlude

8. Startin' Somethin'

9. A Night In The Bronx With Lord & Gunz

10. Who Am I

11. Deja Vu (Uptown Baby)

12. Keep On

13. Worldwide

14. Streets To Da Stage

15. BX Most Wanted Interlude

16. Cross Bronx Expressway

17. Precipitation Interlude

18. My Time To Go

19. Bonus Track 1

I never bought this album when it came out, not even sure why, I guess it didn't really excite me when it dropped. Or it could have been my friend bought it and I just dubbed it from him. None the less, I threw it in when I got home and it pretty much sucks. Oh well, it was cheap.


C.E.B. - Countin' Endless Bank (Ruffhouse, 1992) $1.50

1. Seems You Forgot

2. Goes Like This

3. Get the Point

4. Man

5. Pass the Ammo

6. F*ck 'Im Up

7. Back up in da Joint

8. M.D.

9. Pass the Buddha

10. Monkey on My Back

11. Gorilla I think Steady B was the shit, but for some reason, I slept on this when it originally dropped. I guess I had a hard time seeing Steady B as a gangsta...boy was I wrong. Cool C and Stead took the gangsta thing a bit too far and the rest, well, we all know the story. I didn't like this when I first heard this a couple of years ago and Polarity said I was crazy. I gave it another listen and its not as bad as I first thought. Dove Shack - This Is The Shack (Fontana/Def jam, 1995) $1.50 1. Intro (Skit) 2. Smoke Out 3. This Is The Shack 4. Summertime In The LBC 5. Bomb Drop 6. The Train (Skit) 7. Fuck Ya Mouth 8. Slap A Hoe (Skit) 9. Freestyle Interview (Skit) 10. Freestyle 11. Crooked Cop (Skit) 12. Ghetto Life 13. East Side Party 14. Rollin Wit A Gang 15. We Funk (The G Funk) 16. There'll Come A Day 17. Summertime In The LBC (Rap)

This was another album I'm not sure why I never bought. I loved "Summertime In The LBC" and "This Is The Shack", but I never dipped into the cash box for the CD. Giving it a listen Friday night, I loved it. Not sure if it was the seventh beer I was on, or the Madden game I was enjoying, but G-funk never sounded so good to me. Only bad thing, it's the fucking clean version. So if anyone wants the clean version, I'll put the link up, but I doubt anyone would.


Too Nice - Cold Facts (Arista, 1989) $2.00

1		Cold Facts (4:23)
2		Here I Come (4:35)
3		Rock The Girl, Gee (Every Inch) (4:41)
4		Keep Doggin' Em (3:57)
5		The Phantom Of Hip Hop (4:41)
6		Two Can Play The Game (Who's Makin' Love to Your Old Lady) (4:57)
7		I Git Minze (4:30)
8		Cold Wild Strong Isle (3:50)
9		Everybody Loves Sex (4:25)
10		I'm Sad (3:48)

I know what you are thinking, that cover looks like some horrible group. While Too Nice isn't exactly the greatest thing since chocolate and peanut butter, but they are better than they look. I'm not sure if I remember them back in the day. I think it was one of those things I always saw at the record stores I frequented, but never bought because I never heard them. Bust the Facts posted it up this past spring and I kind of enjoyed it, soooo, I found it and the rest is history.


Kriss Kross - Totally Krossed Out (Ruffhouse, 1992) $1.50

1. Intro Interview

2. Jump

3. Lil' Boys In Da Hood

4. Warm It Up

5. The Way Of Rhyme

6. Party

7. We're In Da House

8. A Real Bad Dream

9. It's A Shame

10. Can't Stop The Bum Rush

11. You Can't Get With This

12. I Missed The Bus

13. Outro

14. Party (Krossed Mix)

15. Jump (Extended Mix)

Yeah, yeah, yeah I know, nostaligia is a bitch sometimes. I lost my copy of this sometime ago, and I guess I was too cool to get another at the time. Now I'm old enough, I really don't care. It's not that bad. Besides, I'd rather listen to all the old corny hip-pop stuff from yester year than 99% of the shit thats on the radio presentely. At least I did put down the copy of "Please Don't Hurt 'Em, Hammer"

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